From a follower on Twitter comes the 84 pages of emails pertaining to the hyper-partisan and ultra-secretive legislative redistricting process that Republicans in the state legislature didn’t want you or I to see:
The fact that Republicans in our state’s legislature want to hide how they do business from the very citizens who elected them should outrage every single Wisconsinite who values clean, transparent government.
This here page will be especially relevant to fans of Perfesser Rick. NB the chronological sequence of “support” and “needs…the numbers.”
Gotcher ears on, Phil?
“We need to pass the bill so we can see what’s in the bill” – Nancy Pelosi
You really do have a hard time staying on topic, don’t you?
What, no comment about how your elected officials tried to hide behind “attorney client privilege” in order to hide the redistricting process (which is a legislative process) from Wisconsin’s citizens?
If you cared one bit about clean, transparent government, you’d be outraged, but instead you just want to ramble about Nancy Pelosi.
Look over there! A baby bear!
Over where?!?!?!?
@ Monsieur Jimbo
Since I know how much you LOVE Daily Kos, here’s something else for you to chew on regarding this burgeoning scandal:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/02/16/1065133/-Final-Wisconsin-Redistricting-Emails-Released-Lawyers-Discuss-wildly-gerrymandering-?via=siderec
My favorite part of the linked article is the part of it which quotes from the appellate court decision ordering the release of the “84 documents”. Spoiler alert, Jimbo -bobbityboo, your boys really aren’t held in the highest esteem by the justices.
All right, James, I’m not going to make you go look for yourself. Like that was going to EVER happen, right? (*laughing*)
Anyway, big guy, here’s what the Court said in ordering the release of the 84 documents:
“Without a doubt, the Legislature made a conscious choice to involve private lawyers in what gives every appearance of an attempt – albeit poorly disguised – to cloak the private machinations of Wisconsin’s Republican legislators in the shroud of attorney-client privilege. What could have – indeed should have – been accomplished publicly instead took place in private, in an all but shameful attempt to hide the redistricting process from public scrutiny.”
You can almost hear James desperately gasping for air, random words escaping his mouth, as he loses consciousness and goes under.
Speak! Speak! Roll over!
Is it just me or is this kind of exciting? Plenty of work for process servers coming up.
Not just you, Gareth. Not just you.
Perhaps this is how Scott Walker intended all along to create jobs…..for process servers!
James, you claim to want to understand the other side of the political spectrum, though your actions suggest otherwise. But maybe you can help me understand how the republican party in Wisconsin works. Republicans control the state government. They could have gotten just about any redistricting plan through and approved under the normal legislative process. Right?
So why have they found it necessary to do it the hard, and most likely illegal, way? Why did they have to handle this process in such a ham handed way that for the third cycle in a row the district lines will have to be decided by a court, to the benefit of no one? Does anybody on your side of the political spectrum realize that republicans could have accomplished anything they wanted in their agenda had they only exercised….what is the word I’m looking for….discipline?
Non story. redistricting sessions are held in secret all the time. Why does it matter? Once the map bill is introduced, it’s then subject to the same approval process as any other bill; a trip through committees, public hearings, debates on the floors of the Senate and Assembly followed by a vote and then a signature by Walker. No different than a closed caucus session.
Dems and Repubs have been sending redistricting cases to the supreme court to decide since the beginning of time. Quit acting like you libs never played this game. You hired lawyers too!
http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lrb/pubs/im/10im4.pdf
@ Jimbo-bobbity-boo
Definitely not a NON-story, Jimbo, no matter what they are teaching you over at Wingnut Tech.
As I mentioned above, here’s what the Appellate Court had to say in ordering the release of the 84 documents:
“Without a doubt, the Legislature made a conscious choice to involve private lawyers in what gives every appearance of an attempt – albeit poorly disguised – to cloak the private machinations of Wisconsin’s Republican legislators in the shroud of attorney-client privilege. What could have – indeed should have – been accomplished publicly instead took place in private, in an all but shameful attempt to hide the redistricting process from public scrutiny.”
Time to stop drinking the Kool-Aid, my misguided wingnut brother.
You just couldn’t be more wrong about this. It’s right there in black and white. Why not just read the decision handed down by the Court, rather than blather on, and embarrass yourself, with any further objectively rebuttable silliness?
As they say, “Sometimes it is better to remain silent and only be thought the fool, than to ‘speak’ and remove all doubt.”
Are you aware that the dems hired private lawyers in the past for their redistricting meetings?
You’re missing the point, James, or are you?
You are either incredibly stupid or you are incredibly disingenuous. Which is it?
Respond to what the Appellate Court had to say, or just slink away.
And yet I don’t recall them ever claiming the fruits of their meetings with the private lawyers was super-secret and couldn’t be shared with their Republican counterparts or the public.
In the past both parties were provided with funds in the state budget to consult with redistricting experts, consultants and attorneys…in this cycle the majority party did not provide the Democrats with such funds nor access to the actual redistricting process…what could possibly go wrong?
“No different than a closed caucus session.”
Closed caucus sessions are subject to discovery in court. Which is why these idiots attempted the unprecedented scam of cloaking everything in attorney-client privilege.
I hadn’t waded into this here – just haven’t had much time, etc and really haven’t dug into the details of the issue at all. But I figured just to be clear since some think that silence = agreement (which most certainly is no the case for me)…
I think the process & specifically the steps to hide behind privilege were just awful. The winning party get’s to draw the lines – that’s just part of the deal, sucks when “their guys” get to do it, but great when “your guys” do. But whether I agree or disagree with any policies, anything that tries to destroy transparency & hide the process from the public gets my disdain.
Which is exactly what I tried to ask James, but he merely waved it away. Going through the extra trouble is only having the effect of giving the appearance of incompetence. These are supposed to be experienced legislators with knowledge on how government works. And yet they act as rank amateurs. Almost as though protocol and laws don’t apply to them. Or that they are receiving their marching orders from somewhere else. From people who are, in fact, rank amateurs. Why?
Just because the state Republicans won enough elections to take over doesn’t mean that the aren’t the same incompetent and terribly poorly lead guys that they always were. This was the party that couldn’t beat Doyle never mind the fact that he wasn’t even liked by a lot of Democrats.
BTW – is anyone else having problems posting? Mine are failing the first time or two that I post lately.
Yes…I can’t get through via IE…only Firefox
Wow, thank you for posting this. The pages (near 87) concerning the Latino population is very interesting!
The problem with all of these calls for “clean and transparent government” is that the outrage always comes from the party out of power, yet when the power shifts back to the other party they resort to the same backdoor, sleazy politics they were previously “outraged” by. Politics in the US are a disgrace, at every level it is more about power grabs, gamesmanship and partisan politics than it is about truly representing the people. As a conservative I am personally ashamed by the policies of obstructionism being displayed by the Republicans in reference to this issue.
kim, cite me an example of Wisconsin Democrats engaging in the kind of secret (and possibly illegal) dealings when it comes to redistricting.
I know people use the argument of the one in 1980s but from what I read there actually wasn’t too much of a problem and that was drawn by the courts.
1991 from what I read there was another attempt by the Democrats who controlled both houses, but that was vetoed by Tommy Thompson, and drawn by the courts.
The difference now is that GOP controls both the houses and the Governor’s position which was not a position they had in the past. Even when one party ended up controlling both the houses, often times the opposite party controlled the governor.
Looking up on the history, since the 1960s there has been problems with this so the court had to eventually step in to draw the lines.
Zach, nice attempt at spinning the argument, obviously examples regarding redistricting will be difficult to defend because it only happens every 10 years and the same old lame excuses will be used, such as, that was a long time ago, a different administration, blah, blah, blah.
If you can honestly tell me that the Doyle regime, the Obama administration and the Senate Dems have been been “clean and transparent” you are either blinded by politics or not very bright. I believe you to be very intelligent, therefore, please take the blinders off and take an objective look.
@ Kim
Zach isn’t spinning. You’re deflecting.
Understand the difference?
“Blah, blah, blah.”
Is that the new, “Yadda, yadda, yadda”?
(*wink*)
I’m not sure how I missed this comment, but I’d just like to ask kim to explain how many of Gov. Doyle’s former aides were indicted on felony criminal charges during his time as governor?
Keep in mind that Georgia Thompson was exonerated, so she doesn’t count.
Redistricting is an OLD card game. Republicans just have a better hand this time. Deal with it. “Elections have consequences”
And yet you still cannot provide a cogent answer to my earlier questions about why the republicans go to extraordinary extremes to accomplish seemingly simple outcomes. They continue to damage their own brand when they don’t have to. Why?
Our municipality, Marshfield, is not only split from the county, the city is divided between the 23rd and the 29th senate districts. We were in the 24th, so our entire city is among the disenfranchised 300,000 who will not be allowed to vote in either the recalls or the next senate election.
Appellate Court: ““Without a doubt, the Legislature made a conscious choice to involve private lawyers in what gives every appearance of an attempt – albeit poorly disguised – to cloak the private machinations of Wisconsin’s Republican legislators in the shroud of attorney-client privilege. What could have – indeed should have – been accomplished publicly instead took place in private, in an all but shameful attempt to hide the redistricting process from public scrutiny.”
James Booth: “Redistricting is an OLD card game. Republicans just have a better hand this time. Deal with it. Elections have consequences.”
Zuma: Enough generic rightwing talking points and deflection. Stop running away from the substantive points put before you.
Do you remember the old joke about Rudy Giuliani. Who is Rudy Giuliani, asked. The answer? A noun, a verb and “9/11”.
Who is James Booth, you ask? The answer: A noun, a verb and “[deflection] and a rightwing talking point”.
Your ignorance and tunnel-vision, whether feigned or real, isn’t funny anymore.
The Court called the conduct of Republicans here “shameful”. There’s no real way to spin that, is there?
Stop spinning, and “deal with it”.
Wow, there is some serious deflecting on from conservatives justifying their actions. I’m looking through more the history and fascinating thing about is while even if historically Democrats or Republicans had control of both of the houses with the opposing governor at times there was actually no extreme secrecy about it like there is now. Aka they were flouncing around making excuses and did show the plans to the other side. From historical records with his happening right now — this is by far the dirtiest and lowest trick in Wisconsin’s history.
Least say the Republicans as of now are only second to the politicians prior the Progressive Era in terms of corruption. It’s actually quite fascinating.
This is the key difference of the situation, it’s more than “Republicans had a better deal” — it’s the Republicans thinking they are above the law and doing something pretty plainly illegal territory.
@ T
“This is the key difference of the situation, it’s more than ‘Republicans had a better deal’ — it’s the Republicans thinking they are above the law and doing something pretty plainly illegal territory.”
You hit the nail on the head, brother.