And the left has to stop playing to them. I debated posting about this because I thought it seemed kinda silly, but with the continued estrangement between right and left, I thought it might be worthwhile.
Most of us on the left tend to ignore what many moderates and certainly solid conservatives would consider the left wingnuts. But maybe we need to push back a little and keep our sanity on the left…and one should never feed the left trolls either.
I was sitting on the floor at the 2011 State Democratic Convention with a friend who happens to be an elected official. We were listening to the key note addresses on Friday night when one of the speakers (I don’t remember who it was) said she had a message for the Republican moles in the audience.
Well a young man sitting a chair or so over from us started staring at my friend. And during the break between presenters asked if he might have met my friend at the WI State Fair at some point. My friend replied that he often attended the fair but doesn’t remember meeting the young man. The man persisted and was sure he recognized my friend and that they had met at the fair. Again my friend said that was highly unlikely. The young man said, well you look very familiar and my friend said that’s possible since I am in public office. No the young man said, I am certain I met you at the fair when you were running the Republican Party table there. We were both annoyed and this young man was pretty agitated by now. My friend said, I am **** and I am on the ****, and here’s my card. The young man wasn’t persuaded and I told him to stop being so paranoid. It finally took a couple who were sitting behind us to convince him of the situation.
At that point he became very apologetic, but I am not sure he was totally convinced.
It’s too bad the speaker put this doubt into this young mind. It’s too bad that the much of the political media lives on conspiracy theories. It’s too bad sarcasm and humor are lost in the political arena. It’s too bad we don’t see people thinking for themselves and that they can’t seem to sum up two plus two.
There is a lot of energy and excitement being wasted on sideshows that could be channeled to actually accomplish the real goals of our communities.
And it’s really past time for both parties to quell the extremists within their ranks and help redirect them or renounce their efforts as folly or the dangers that they could become…
It’s a fine piece of writing, Zach, and full of good thoughts.
I’ve been accused of being extreme when I bark back at conservatives who love nothing more than snarling at me. For years, I tried the reasonable, thoughtful approach to conservative rhetoric and insults. Over the years, people with that particular mindset have become more ignorant, violent, and abusive. In the last few years, I’ve given up trying to reason with the unreasonable. I bark. If I have to, I’ll bite.
Having, in my time, been a bartender and a cab driver, I know that there is no such thing as reasoning with drunks. Drunks are belligerent, obstreperous, and obnoxious. The only way to communicate with them is to tell them, in no uncertain terms, that they are to shut the fuck up and get the fuck out. That is how I have experienced the conservatives in this day and age. They are no more reasonable than a drunken horse’s ass in a bar.
I don’t go looking for fights, but I’m not afraid to stand up for truth, justice, and my fellow citizens.
It was written by a guy named ED,
and it seemed vague, extrapolating one odd incident to conclusive ends which frankly seem illogical. The left is rather exclusive already to non-blue dogs, so I’m not sure where this is even coming from. People are wary of more “fake David Koch” incidents and more fake candidates and I personally know guys who try to get into certain places while wearing tiny cameras and that sort of thing – moles exist. Everyone wants those few seconds that can be edited into the next big YouTube gotcha Hit.
So the guy thought your buddy was doing the Fake-Candidate Tango. Sign of the times. It’s what’s actually happening you know?
Thank god you guys weren’t drinking Pinot Noir – because then it’s OKAY to get all belligerent at people in public. But you know, pick and choose when it’s saintly to be confrontational and when it’s a big pain in the butt.
Whatever. Keep fighting for truth justice and the American way.
(Centrists only please? yeah, that’s working so well)
Agreed, Annie. This isolated incident does not extrapolate in any way to compare to the whackjobbery currently being perpetrated over among the GOP. Still, that doesn’t mean the premise that there are whackjobs on the left is wrong. Absolutely there are such whackjobs. They just have very little power, if any, unlike the whackjobs int he GOP.
Boy Annie, you’re just full of sunshine.
Yes I used one isolated incident that I personally experienced on the floor of the DPW state convention…but there are plenty of examples of similar behavior on the various left and progressive websites all over Facebook and a few blogs…
The idea that a Republican mole at the DPW convention would be of any value is ludicrous…Zach and I were there on press passes covering the event along with a dozen other bloggers, the regular media was there covering the event, the DPW was streaming the keynotes, and anyone with $20 could get a visitor pass and attend most of the convention events. Not much to hide under those conditions.
And I am not suggesting disengaging from confronting nonsense from the right wingnuts, I am just suggesting we need to be aware of ours as well and not condone asinine behavior in our ranks either.
Sorry that you don’t like my first name…but my father and son bravely carried them into battle (WWII and the ‘stan) so you could make fun of it via this blog…
Annie K – sounds like most of your conversations take place in bars. You spew filth and angst in this blog and I am doubtful that you have ever debated in a respectable manner. The one thing that I have ever read from you is all I have to judge this on but so far… so bad.
I am however totally sober so let’s get into a true debate with intelligence in mind and not to just smear and attack with anger.
I will let you start off if you would like by telling me why your candidate is the right choice. If you are not a raging left wing bar politician you will be able to do this without cussing or by mentioning Romney or making fun of the right. You will only need to talk about Obama’s resume and what he can offer to better America. I am not particularly for Romney but I will retort with the same positive conversation.
Ed:
These are some interesting comments, and while I’ve never been to the democratic convention–or the republican convention–for that matter I agree with the sentiment behind your anecdote.
The real problem, as I see it on both sides, is that few people are actually taught anymore the formal rules of making an argument and how to respond to one. Too many people consider making a concession a loss of face–as something personal. They lack the discipline to say:”that’s a really good point; I’ll need to think about it.” This is why Jan must sometimes just tell people to shut up–because they do not know how to respond to the logical arguments she is making. When you add to this the understanding that most people are closed minded because they are emotionally attached to their idiology, it becomes evident that most arguments are never going to change anyone’s mind.
One thing I’ve sadly noticed about political blogs is that–recognizing the closed mindedness of people deliberately or by accident–they never attempt to engage in any real persuasion. Liberals and conservatives never stop to deeply consider the merits of those assumptions which the other holds as a starting point for discussion and analysis. There is no attempt to build common ground. Cleverness, it seems, has been reduced to “gotcha” or personal attack or the simple dismissal of arguments as talking points.
In the end, all we can do is demand a higher level of rhetoric from those who desire to serve us and those the are elected to do so.
Sorry, Ed. That’s what I get for not looking at the author’s name. I think it is still a thoughtful piece of writing.
Too bad Annie’s contribution wasn’t as coherent and thoughtful.
Actually I need to apologize a bit…I missed that this was attributed to Zach and that Annie was being helpful…I thought she was dissing me…Sorry Annie!
Thoughtful? I wonder. The loon you describe, Ed, is not working from any ideological perspective beyond working far too zealously for his “team.” Is that really analogous to the wingnuts on the right? I see him as merely a loon, not a guy who believes in disproved economic, social, medical and political theories, who misinterprets the constitution at will, etc., like the right wingnuts do. How many left wingers are bent on denying the Holocaust, the theory of evolution, the separation of church and state, the humanity of gays, or even denying anything analogous to those things?
no he is not working from a particular ideological perspective…but he is working from the penchant and glorification of ‘conspiracy theories’…that well…quite frankly don’t pan out.
Steven:
How many right-wingers are bent on denying the holocaust? Can you name one reasonably well-known conservative who does–or any polling data which suggests that “wing-nuts” hold this belief? Or, for that matter, the Theory of Evolution? To me, it seems that you are part of the problem with political discourse, not part of the solution. You see conservatives as morally inferior or intellectually inferior. However, if your comments about Jefferson’s letters or evolution or the holocaust are meant to categorize a tiny fringe of the right, why even bring that up? Are there crazy people on the right? You bet. But the left has their share as well. Why not step your game up a notch or two?
Bachman denies the theory of evolution. She is currently polling ahead of Mitt Romney for the Republican nomination for President. In a debate among Republican candidates three years ago, only one was willing to admit he believed in the theory of evolution. Does that satisfy you?
Speakers at the DPW state convention should not be addressing republican ” moles” from the stage. Good God.
If we take the high, open road and a common sense message to a broader swath of people about genuine health care reform, bringing our troops home and a just and fair tax code, we’ll have little to hide and there will be precious little for republican moles to discover.
Oh, Jan- so all conservatives are evil and nasty
That is really deep thinking- which is why conservatives have so little regard for you leftist sheep